Saturday, November 15, 2008

Homosexual activists accused of 'domestic terrorism'

Letters were sent to the Salt Lake City headquarters of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, where powder spilled on a mail clerk's hand, and also to a temple in Los Angeles. Priliminary tests have found the white powdery substance found in both packages tested nontoxic, the FBI said Friday.


"The FBI on Friday also said it has labeled its probe into the incidents as a domestic terrorism investigation.

"Obviously it instills fear in the public eye and causes people not to feel safe," Becerra said. "It is illegal to mail something out and to threaten the use of a biological weapon or even pretend it's a biological weapon."

The LDS temples in Salt Lake City and Los Angeles received envelopes on Thursday containing a powdery substance. So did the Knights of Columbus, a Catholic fraternal organization based in New Haven, Conn. Both organizations were heavy backers of Proposition 8, the measure in California that narrowly passed Nov. 4, banning same-sex marriage.

LDS temples in California, Salt Lake City and New York have been the subject of mass demonstrations over the faith's heavy involvement in the campaign to pass Proposition 8. More demonstrations are planned this weekend over marriage and gay rights — including three in Salt Lake City."
from: http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,705263061,00.html?pg=2


"The FBI is still investigating both cases, spokesman Juan T. Becerra said, noting that it's a crime to release a substance to threaten harm and stoke public fear.

"Even if you send a hoax threat, you're still in violation of federal law," Becerra said.

Separately, the coalition of religious groups behind the successful measure held a news conference to denounce protests carried out since Election Day.

The backlash has included calls for a boycott of Utah ski resorts and California businesses whose owners donated to the cause.

"Our opponents do not like the outcome and that is to be respected. They fought hard and they feel defeated and that is understandable," said Frank Schubert, co-manager of the Yes on 8 campaign. "What they do not have the right to do, however, is to harass and intimidate people. And they do not have the right to commit acts of domestic terrorism against our supporters"."
- from: http://www.onenewsnow.com/Culture/Default.aspx?id=321402


The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints' First Presidency issued a statement Friday urging respect and civility in public discourse:

"Since the people of California voted to reaffirm the sanctity of traditional marriage between a man and a woman on November 4, 2008, places of worship have been targeted by opponents of Proposition 8 with demonstrations and, in some cases, vandalism. People of faith have been intimidated for simply exercising their democratic rights. These are not actions that are worthy of the democratic ideals of our nation. The end of a free and fair election should not be the beginning of a hostile response in America.

The Church is keenly aware of the differences of opinion on this difficult and sensitive matter. The reasons for this principled stand in defense of marriage have already been articulated elsewhere. However, some of what we have seen since Californians voted to pass Proposition 8 has been deeply disappointing.

Attacks on churches and intimidation of people of faith have no place in civil discourse over controversial issues. People of faith have a democratic right to express their views in the public square without fear of reprisal. Efforts to force citizens out of public discussion should be deplored by people of goodwill everywhere.

We call upon those who have honest disagreements on this issue to urge restraint upon the extreme actions of a few that are further polarizing our communities and urge them to act in a spirit of mutual respect and civility towards each other."
- from: http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/first-presidency-urges-respect-civility-in-public-discourse

12 comments:

Ross said...

I would urge the Mormon Church to leave gays alone. I would urge the US Government to take away the Mormon Church's tax-exempt status AT ONCE. I would urge you to stop spreading hatred toward gays. Funny...don't really include posts on gay-bashings, gays being murdered for their orientation, Mormon sexual identity-reassignment practices (including electrodes on genitals, pectorals, hands, feet)--Wow, seems like you're a bit one-sided on this, huh? You can't POSSIBLY try to claim that gays are the perpetrators of more violence than they are victims.

Lies and the lying liars who tell them.

All the usual right-wing looney tune tactics: lie by omission, distort the facts, leave out what doesn't fit in with the party line, repeat talking point ad nauseum, and above all else, NEVER admit when you are wrong.

Learn acceptance and love.
I was raised Mormon--it's a ridiculous belief system founded on blatant, obvious lies--founded by a lifelong scam artist, no less--but hey, if people want to believe lies, that's they're prerogative. Just keep your lies away from my rights.

And you try to call Obama a fascist. LOL

Gaylynne Coates said...

Ok - First of all...
Let see who sent the white powder stuff to whom?? Who is protesting and marching around the temples of worship and churches day and night?

Who needs to leave whom alone?

Why don't you "no" on prop 8 people accept the will of the people of California and leave the Mormon church alone?

People of faith have a democratic right to express their views in the public square without fear of reprisal. Efforts to force citizens out of public discussion should be deplored by people of goodwill everywhere.

Please send me some articles or facts of where the Mormon Church approved of or encouraged gays to be murdered or bashed for their orientation? This is an insane accusation.

No one is forcing you to be straight or to be Mormon - but don't force us to change the Bible (that you don't believe in) to make you feel better about yourself.

Ross said...

1. I never said the mormons condoned murder--just hatred.

2. I feel great about myself.

3. I never asked you to change your precious bible. I would simply appreciate it if you would stop using your bible, your hatred, and your fear to oppress my people.

Yet again, more lies! And to answer your question, all of you holier-than-thou bible-thumpers need to leave gays alone. That's what started this problem in the first place.

Efforts to force gays to live their lives as second-class citizens should "be deplored by people of goodwill everywhere." It doesn't matter what you think about gays--hate speech does not belong in the constitution of any state, much less in the Constitution of the United States. The next eight years under PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA will be beautiful, indeed. Funny how McCain isn't spell-checked, where as Obama's name comes up as a misspelling...

Ross said...

Oh, and here are some readings on how the mormons have propagated hatred toward gays:

http://www.connellodonovan.com/lgbtmormons.html

http://www.affirmation.org/media/2004_12.shtml

This one's hilarious. Evasive as your average politician (from EITHER side, mind you):

http://www.affirmation.org/learning/oaks_interview.shtml

http://www.connellodonovan.com/abom.html#boise

Want some more? Is that enough? Ready to admit that you are blatantly wrong yet?

I imagine not.

-Ross
oh, by the way, that took 2 minutes of searching. Go ahead, dig deeper--I dare you.

Ross said...

http://www.connellodonovan.com/abom.html#byu

better read that, too.

g.c. said...

If your so happy with yourself, Why are you wasting your time, reading my blog???

Why are you wasting my time, leaving idiotic comments????

Yes - the next 4 - 8 years will be very interesting for all you Obama supporters -

I say get prepared because the economy is going to tank and there are going to be A LOT of problems. Of course, all the Obama supporters will deny that socialism has caused the economy to tank - they'll blame it on Bush's policies (which if you ACTUALLY read about it - the policies that caused the housing market to fail which has caused other markets to fail were ACTUALLY Clinton's policies that mucked with the free market. This failure was predicted way back 1999 before Bush was even in. see: http://aredvoiceinabluestate.blogspot.com/2008/10/fannie-mae-origin-of-trouble.html)

And to answer your other questions:

No one is forcing gays to live a 2nd class life. What proof of this do you have? Gays in California have all the rights and benefits that marriage couples do. The marriage amendment was not about taking anyone's rights or benefits away. This amendment does not hurt gays or prevent them from living together, working, getting benefits, etc.

Gays are actually a protected class. A huge mob of gays can beat up on an elderly woman out in the open and that is perfectly acceptable to the gay community, but if it was the other way around, the elderly woman would get doubly punished for the crime because it was a "hate crime" - what about "hate crimes" against specific religions???

Gays can have open sex and pornography in the streets in front of children and have fairs to openly announce to the world what they are doing, if heterosexuals did this - they would be arrested for indecent exposure or prostitution.

Just because Christians want to keep the definition of marriage and not change it, we are Hateful??

Marriage is NOT primarily a contract between individuals to ratify their affections and provide for mutual obligations. Rather, marriage and family are vital instruments for rearing children and teaching them to become responsible adults.

If we are going to change the meaning of marriage, let do it for everyone. If gay marriage is OK - What about three men getting married? What about four or five of them getting married? Marriage should be for anyone who loves each other. It is a well known fact that gay men are typically not monogamous - so suppose three or four of them want to get together. Why keep the definition of marriage limited to two, that is not fair to those who "love" more than one person.

And if homosexual men can marry more than one, then it should be alright for anyone to have multiple wives and husbands. Let's reintroduce polygamy back into our society. It is not fair to all the polygamist that have been hiding and doing this in isolation. Let them come out and we should all embrace their lifestyle too - very discriminatory, if we don't, right?? If we want to have a "live and let live" policy then we can't say yes to homosexuals - but no to polygamist.

And what about brothers and sisters getting married, or brothers and brothers getting married? If they love each other and want to spend and commit the rest of their lives together - why should we stop them. If we want to have "live and let live" policy - then we need to be fair. If we want to change what marriage means for one group of people then if other groups want to change it - we have to be fair and let them change the definition too.

No one is advocating hatred. You'd like to think it was a "Live and let Live World" However, Homosexual advocates are punishing churches for their beliefs, and requiring churches to embrace their homosexual lifestyle (thus to disregard the teaching in the bible) this is why churches have supported the marriage amendment-- here are some examples:

"After same-sex marriage was legalized in Massachusetts, Catholic Charities, a major facilitator of adoptions, had to drop their adoption program because they knew they would be required to by law to facilitate adoption of children to same-sex couples and they did not want to face lawsuits."

"A photographer in New Mexico was fined $6,500 for politely declining to photograph a "commitment ceremony" of two lesbians because same-sex relationships violated her religious beliefs."

"A church in New Jersey lost its tax-exempt status for some of it's property for refusing to rent out it's pavilion for a lesbian "commitment ceremony."

"Pastors in Sweden and Canada were prosecuted for speaking out publicly against same-sex marriage based on their reading of biblical scripture."

"Two Bible publishers in the U.S. have been sued over biblical teachings against homosexuality."

"Doctors in California were sued for declining to artificially inseminate a lesbian women because it was against their religious beliefs. The court ruled against the doctors and ordered them to pay damages."

Before you know it, the bible is going to be banned in America because it teaches against homosexuality or it is going to have to be edited/changed.

Advocates may argue that homosexuals have not "chosen" this. They are comparing it with the disabilities acts and the civil rights movement. Being gay isn't a disability or an ethnicity. Even if one is born with these tendencies, it still is a choice one makes to live the lifestyle. There are many organizations like Portland Fellowship (see: http://www.portlandfellowship.com/) whose belief is that there is freedom from homosexuality and it comes through a person... the Lord Jesus Christ. Their programs were inspired by men and women who have experienced freedom from homosexual desire and behavior through the love and mercy of Jesus Christ. Their ministry has helped hundreds of men and women find biblical resolution to their homosexuality and has ministered to their families, friends, and church leaders. Homosexual advocacy groups would have you believe there is no way to change so just accept it and change God's word.

Helping people find biblical resolution through Jesus Christ - Is that hatred? We worked with this organization - hate to tell you, no electrodes on genitals, etc. were being used....

And you gave me examples of INDIVIDUAL's point of view's not the Mormon church. I don't go to the church of connellodonovan or the church of any other member. Because "members" do something that doesn't mean the church endorses it. Members smoke and drink - does that mean the church endorses it. Members have hate blogs against the leaders - does that mean the church endorses it? Harry Reid endorses/supports abortion and a lot of ideas that the church doesn't endorse.

If member were being hateful against gays - the church did NOT endorse it. - use the church's official website when providing me quotes on what the church endorse - since the content on that website is what they are officially endorsing. I've looked over lds.org and can't seem to find an article that telling us to hate our neighbors who are gay????

You stated Hinkley was advocating hatred??? Was President Hinckley advocating hatred for gays in the interview with Larry King Live? let see what else he said:

HINCKLEY: Well, we're not anti-gay. We are pro-family. Let me put it that way. And we LOVE these people and try to work with them and HELP them.

I read Oak's interview too:
OAKS: "I'm afraid I don't see that as the problem of the Church, which stands for truth and which teaches the standards of God and asks His children to conform to those standards. We don't expect standards to be changed because they are inconvenient or painful. We don't justify thievery because a person is hungry or jealous. We ask people to control impulses in order that we can live in a civilized society. God has asked His children to control their impulses in order that they can keep His commandments and realize their destiny."

That preaching hatred?????

I guess when men cheat on their wives and they are asked to repent - that is hateful too. Anytime we are asked to have standards and values - is that hateful??

hmmmm.... this is more like hatred:

"Burn their f---ing churches to the ground, and then tax the charred timbers," wrote "World O Jeff" on the JoeMyGod blogspot.

On a blog website, "Tread" wrote, "I hope the No on 8 people have a long list and long knives."

On the "Queerty" website, "Stenar" asked, "Can someone in CA please go burn down the Mormon temples there, PLEASE. I mean seriously. DO IT."

"I'm going to give them something to be f---ing scared of. … I'm a radical who is now on a mission to make them all pay for what they've done," wrote "Jonathan."

On yet another site, "Americablog," "scottinsf" wrote, "Trust me. I've got a big list of names of mormons and catholics that were big supporters of Prop 8. … As far as mormons and catholics … I warn them to watch their backs."

Ross said...

from
http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=f318118dd536c010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&locale=0&sourceId=c31c226fecfdb010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&hideNav=1

The mormons themselves. I do believe comparing gays to SATAN qualifies at hate. Good enough?

Homosexuality

The Church’s stand on homosexual relations provides another arena where we offend the devil. I expect that the statement of the First Presidency and the Twelve against homosexual marriages will continue to be assaulted. Satan is only interested in our misery, which he promotes by trying to persuade men and women to act contrary to God’s plan. One way he does this is by encouraging the inappropriate use of sacred creative powers. A bona fide marriage is one between a man and a woman solemnized by the proper legal or ecclesiastical authority. Only sexual relations between husband and wife within the bonds of marriage are acceptable before the Lord.

There is some widely accepted theory extant that homosexuality is inherited. How can this be? No scientific evidence demonstrates absolutely that this is so. Besides, if it were so, it would frustrate the whole plan of mortal happiness. Our designation as men or women began before this world was. In contrast to the socially accepted doctrine that homosexuality is inborn, a number of respectable authorities contend that homosexuality is not acquired by birth. The false belief of inborn homosexual orientation denies to repentant souls the opportunity to change and will ultimately lead to discouragement, disappointment, and despair.

Alternatives to the legal and loving marriage between a man and a woman are helping to unravel the fabric of human society. I am sure this is pleasing to the devil. The fabric I refer to is the family. These so-called alternative life-styles must not be accepted as right, because they frustrate God’s commandment for a life-giving union of male and female within a legal marriage as stated in Genesis. If practiced by all adults, these life-styles would mean the end of the human family.

Ross said...

Also note that he gives no proof as to who these sources are denying that homosexuality is an inborn trait.

g.c. said...

You state: "I do believe comparing gays to SATAN qualifies at hate. Good enough?"

To respond -I am assuming you are taking it from these two quote as they are the only two that mention Satan:

"Satan is only interested in our misery, which he promotes by trying to persuade men and women to act contrary to God’s plan. One way he does this is by encouraging the inappropriate use of sacred creative powers...."

and

"Alternatives to the legal and loving marriage between a man and a woman are helping to unravel the fabric of human society. I am sure this is pleasing to the devil.... because they frustrate God’s commandment for a life-giving union of male and female within a legal marriage as stated in Genesis. If practiced by all adults, these life-styles would mean the end of the human family."

These are the quotes that mention SATAN, but I never heard the church comparing gays to SATAN.

Let examine what the church has said:

"Satan is interested in our misery. Satan promotes our misery by trying to persuade men and women to act contrary to God’s plan."

Satan doesn't want us to obey any of the commandments (God's Plan). Satan is delighted when we choose to not obey God. When someone steals, cheats, lies, commits adultery, or any does any sin; Satan is happy. This (sin) is what Satan wants to promote. This statement is NOT calling a sinner Satan or promoting hate. It is stating that Satan is happy with the sinner's behavior.

Why is that hateful?

When I break a commandment - I know Satan is happy and God is sad with my behavior. Why is that hateful? How is that preaching hate?

Next quote:
"Alternative to a marriage between a man and a woman are helping to unravel the fabric of human society. I am sure this is pleasing to the devil.... because they frustrate God’s commandment for a life-giving union of male and female within a legal marriage as stated in Genesis."

Genesis states a commandment given to man and women from God: Gen. 1:28 "And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth"

"If homosexuality was practiced by ALL adults, these life-styles would mean the end of the human family"

That's a fact, do I need to explain it?? If there were no heterosexual couples- there would be no more babies. "Multiply and replenishing the earth" is one of God's commandments. So homosexuality goes against God's commandment.

Explaining the bible and the how homosexuality conflicts with God's commandments, is that promoting hate?

Explaining that Satan is happy when we sin, is that promoting hate?

Please..., if this is the best you can come up with how the Mormon Church promotes hate, you don't really have an argument.

I agree people can be mean and do mean things - but truly they are doing it in their OWN name and not in the name of Christ or the name of the Church.

The church teaches right from wrong. The church teaches us that Satan wants us to sin as this will lead to misery. This is not promoting hate. Christ and God teach us to love the sinner, not the sin. You would have God love the sinner and the sin. This just can't be. Saying that God does not love sin isn't promoting hate. Providing a way for people to repent and change is also not promoting hate.

You would say "if churches don't embrace and accept me as I am then churches are hateful." When truly there is no hate or promoting of hate for the person.

and AGAIN - no one if forcing you to believe as I do. I am not expecting you to believe the bible. I have friends who are Catholic and they believe differently than I do on certain issues - do I think they are hateful because they have different views? no.

But differences in beliefs should not be construed as hate.

g.c. said...

Ross -Please do not leave any more hate comments on my blog as I will delete them immediately.

You don't want to learn any facts and I gave you amply time to provide something of substance... this is all I got:

You spew hatred against Christians for their beliefs when you cannot provide an ounce of evidence that Christianity teaches and promotes hate.

You deny facts about studies done about the homosexual lifestyle being a high risk of HIV/AIDS. Facts and studies by the CDC don't lie. Bury your head in the sand, maybe you'll be one of the lucky 2 out of 3 that doesn't get HIV/AIDS.

You state murder of the innocent is justifiable because "we had too many people on the planet as is".

You complain about your second class life that you have been forced to live but provide me with no proof of how any of your rights are taken away.

Your logic is so twisted: (i.e. people that support the prop 8 marriage amendment are hacking onto other 'Yes on 8' websites to put up lesbian porno. - I am sure that people that support a common cause (marriage) are trying to destroy that cause (marriage) - doesn't make any sense????

You haven't provided me one substantial facts of any sort and all of your arguments are extremely weak.

You tell me you are happy, but All you do is spew hatred. Find another liberal hate blog that doesn't have any substance - then you can spew your hatred with them.

Ross said...

This is sad. After you know that I've decided not to leave any comments, you go back through and reply on every thread I commented on, trying to make me sound like a fool. Well, Gaylynne, (by the way, is the "Gay" in your name a source of your bitterness?<--that's a "joke" by the way. Not "HATE" as you will undoubtedly label it)--keep living in your little world of hate. Bothers me...let's see...not a bit. Later, hater ;-)
oh, and go ahead and delete this comment since it's "hate"--yr actually just being callow, a complete coward, but hey--what's new? That's the conservative Thang, right?

g.c. said...

What I don't understand is why you keep coming back?

Of course, I commented on every thread with facts- It is MY blog -and I post facts to clear up misconceptions - how is that trying to make you sound like a fool?

If you don't like what I post, then it is quite simple:
Don't come back.
Don't read it - no one is forcing you to do this.
Find a liberal blog that will be more to your liking.
Or you can even start your own blog.

I asked you not to comment anymore because you just want to sling mud - you don't want to understand anything – you just want to fight.

You refused to look at any facts, articles or sources -even if I referenced you to my blog or another’s blog -everything posted there is referenced from other reputable sources. (yes, even liberal sources - NY times, Washington Post, LA times, etc.....)

Here are some other reasons why I asked you not to comment:

1. You spew hatred against Christians for their beliefs (and your "joke" about my name is not the "hate" I'm talking about) -These are just a few of the hateful accusation you made:
"Lies and the lying liars who tell them…”
"All the usual right-wing looney tune tactics: lie by omission, distort the facts..."
"Yet again, more lies!.."
"Wake up. You are the oppressor.
You are the fascist.
You are the evil grain of hatred in our society,"
"SHAME. Your self-righteousness and hatred seem to know no bounds" etc...

BUT yet you cannot provide an ounce of evidence where Christianity or where the Mormon Church teaches and promotes hatred and lies of homosexuals.

The resources you provided me with are: Teachings from the bible, teachings about differentiating between right and wrong, teachings to help overcome our weaknesses, teachings about how God doesn’t want us to sin and Satan does. You don't have to believe this, but differences in beliefs - That is promoting Hate??????????

You want hate? Here some examples of some hate and intolerance from the very people that demand tolerance:

"Protesters of Proposition 8 in California (the marriage amendment) shoved aside a 69-year-old woman who was bearing a cross. They spit on her and stomped on her cross.

Prop. 8 supporter Jose Nunez, 37, was assaulted brutally while distributing yard signs to other supporters after church services at the St. Stanislaus Parish in Modesto.

In Carlsbad, Calif., a man was charged with punching his elderly neighbors over their pro-Prop. 8 signs.

Calvary Chapel Chino Hills was spray painted by vandals after they learned that the church served as an official collection point for Prop. 8 petitions.

Letters containing white powder (obviously mimicking anthrax) were sent to the Salt Lake City headquarters of the Mormon church and to a temple in Los Angeles. (Thankfully, the FBI said the substance was nontoxic.)

The 25-year artistic director of the California Musical Theatre, who also happens to be a Mormon, was muscled to resign because of his $1,000 donation to the campaign to ban gay marriage in California.

A pro-homosexual, pro-anarchy organization named Bash Back marched into the middle of a church service and flung fliers and condoms to the congregants. They also hung a banner from the balcony that featured two lesbians in provocative positions at the pulpit.

Thousands of gay-rights demonstrators stood in front of the Mormon temple in Los Angeles shouting "Mormon scum."

Religion-bashing protesters filled with hate decried the "hate" at Rick Warren's Saddleback Church in Orange County, Calif.

Vandals defaced the Calvary Chapel in Chino Hills, Calif., because church members had collected Prop. 8 petitions. One worshiper's car was keyed with the slogans "Gay sex is love" and "SEX." Another car's antenna and windshield wipers were broken.

A Los Angeles restaurant whose manager made a small donation to the Prop. 8 campaign has been besieged nightly by hordes of protesters who have disrupted business, intimidated patrons and brought employees to tears. Out of fear for their jobs and their lives, workers at El Coyote Mexican Cafe pooled together $500 to pay off the bullies.

In San Francisco, Christians evangelizing in the Castro District needed police protection after the same-sex marriage mob got physical and hounded them off the streets.

Anti-Prop. 8 boycotters are going after the left-wing Sundance Film Festival because it does business in Mormon-friendly Utah.

And lastly, the tolerance-preaching activists also have taken their anger to the blogosphere, where posts have planted ideas ranging from burning churches to storming the citadels of government until our society is forced to overturn Prop. 8. You even can find donor blacklists online. The lists include everyone who financially backed Prop. 8 -- even those who gave as little as $46 -- with the obvious objective that these individuals will be bantered and boycotted for doing so."

Had the same level of violence and rhetoric been directed toward homosexuals or their groups, there would be accusations and a public outcry of “hate crimes.”


2. You deny facts about studies done about the homosexual lifestyle being a high risk of HIV/AIDS. (i.e."AIDS is not a gay disease. It's not 1986 anymore.") Read the studies and the facts done by the Center for Disease Control and Prevention (not a biased source) Facts don't lie. Maybe drug users should cry "discrimination" also since they can't give blood either since it is another high risk behavior. Bury your head in the sand Ross - pretend that living the gay lifestyle is not a high risk behavior, maybe you'll be one of the lucky 2 out of 3 that doesn't get HIV/AIDS.

3. You state murder of the innocent is justifiable because “we had too many people on the planet as is." 1.3 million human beings are murdered every year in America, alone! It is much worse than the Jewish holocaust. But because the children who are killed can't communicate with us before they're killed or during the death procedures, liberals figure that being tortured and killed during medical experiments in Nazi camps must have been far worse. How are your thoughts any different than Hitler’s? Because it is called a "choice" - you believe it is acceptable. You claim you are a "victim" - but then provide no help to the most innocent "victims" in our society. How is that justifiable?

3. You complain about your second class life that you have been forced to live but provide me with no proof of how any of your rights or benefits are taken away. The truth is that the great majority of Prop. 8 advocates are not bigots or hatemongers. They are American citizens who are following 5,000 years of human history and the belief of every major people and religion: Marriage is a sacred union between a man and a woman. Their pro-Prop. 8 votes weren't intended to deprive any group of its rights; they were safeguarding their honest convictions regarding the boundaries of marriage.

What about all the rights that are being taken away from us straight religious folks - you state "utter BS -not happening" but I have given you ample proof of how it is already happening. I don't believe in discriminating or treating others badly, but I don't want my children to have to learn to "fist" at school just because you do it.
More proof of how it is being forced in the schools and on churches here: http://aredvoiceinabluestate.blogspot.com/2008/11/more-on-prop-8.html and http://aredvoiceinabluestate.blogspot.com/2008/11/sex-education-and-homosexual-awareness.html
(yes they are my blogs - but they are referenced with articles and sources where I received the info).

4. Your logic is twisted: (i.e. people that support the prop 8 marriage amendment are hacking onto other 'Yes on 8' websites to put up lesbian porno. - I am sure that people who support a common cause (marriage) are trying to destroy that cause (marriage) - doesn't make any sense???? You’re either for it or against the prop.

You haven't provided me any substantial facts of any sort. All you want to do is sling mud. I have better things to do with my time than sling mud with you and that is why I asked you not to comment anymore.